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In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming viole

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In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming viole

Postby djpray2k » 26 Feb 2013, 17:00

This is nice to hear but I'm sure there are better arguments...

The Japan/America example is an odd one. Someone wishing to pick a fight over this could argue that it concerns the games being played. I don't have the stats to hand but I'd suggest America (or the West) is more interested shooters and the like where as Japan is better known for it's passion for RPGs and mobile gaming.

Yeah, Zuck is a great success and apparently gaming helped this but I'm pretty sure gaming is also responsible for a bunch of kids doing sod all. The better argument is why games? Books, TV, they're all pretty sedentary but don't get half the flack. I'm sure books and TV also inspire kids.

Yes...games can be a learning tool but I'd argue that a vast proportion of time spent playing FIFA and COD hasn't equated into us being blessed with an army of super smart kids ready to show China what smart kids really look like.

Let's be realistic. Those against use crappy arguments to put games down and those for complain about it, they then go and use some other pretty poor arguments to put their case forward. Quite often we're as bad as each other.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby beemoh » 26 Feb 2013, 18:59

djpray2k wrote:Let's be realistic. Those against use crappy arguments to put games down and those for complain about it, they then go and use some other pretty poor arguments to put their case forward. Quite often we're as bad as each other.


Well, yes- but their crappy arguments actually get heard.

It's all well and good coming up with your "bunch of kids doing sod all" counterpoint to Mark Zuckerberg- but it's not a counterpoint, as it is the generally accepted 'wisdom'. The point isn't that Zuck exists, but that nobody's talking about him in this context.

In fact, it's the very first thing Livingstone says. Nobody's suggesting that games only have positive effects- but there's plenty of people saying they only have bad ones.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby fatgangsta » 26 Feb 2013, 19:27

Yeesh rare thing a politician with sense so the end of world will be soon
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby Stuart Richards » 26 Feb 2013, 20:45

When playing a first person shooter, you're placed at the heart of a battlefield experience and you kill hundreds of enemy with grenades, guns and knives. To try to claim that doesn't encourage violence, is about as absurd as it gets.

I'm Getting tired of the industry's denial of this very real problem. Everyone I know who plays computer games mood changes almost instantly when they start the game. They become highly stressed, agitated and extremely angry. Especially when they lose, to deny this is just ludicrous.It's just part of gaming, everyone knows someone who takes things too seriously online, the rants and screams of online nuts are part of gaming lore.

I and many people I know have stopped playing games because of how bad tempered it makes you.

So cut the bull CVG and start being honest about this very real problem. To claim gaming doesn't encourage violence is like trying to deny driving doesn't lead to road rage incidents.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby Zubee » 26 Feb 2013, 21:10

Stuart Richards wrote:When playing a first person shooter, you're placed at the heart of a battlefield experience and you kill hundreds of enemy with grenades, guns and knives. To try to claim that doesn't encourage violence, is about as absurd as it gets.

I'm Getting tired of the industry's denial of this very real problem. Everyone I know who plays computer games mood changes almost instantly when they start the game. They become highly stressed, agitated and extremely angry. Especially when they lose, to deny this is just ludicrous.It's just part of gaming, everyone knows someone who takes things too seriously online, the rants and screams of online nuts are part of gaming lore.

I and many people I know have stopped playing games because of how bad tempered it makes you.

So cut the bull CVG and start being honest about this very real problem. To claim gaming doesn't encourage violence is like trying to deny driving doesn't lead to road rage incidents.


Spoken with the true ignorance of someone who has totally missed the point of the post.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby kimoak » 27 Feb 2013, 08:36

Stuart Richards wrote:When playing a first person shooter, you're placed at the heart of a battlefield experience and you kill hundreds of enemy with grenades, guns and knives. To try to claim that doesn't encourage violence, is about as absurd as it gets.

I'm Getting tired of the industry's denial of this very real problem. Everyone I know who plays computer games mood changes almost instantly when they start the game. They become highly stressed, agitated and extremely angry. Especially when they lose, to deny this is just ludicrous.It's just part of gaming, everyone knows someone who takes things too seriously online, the rants and screams of online nuts are part of gaming lore.

I and many people I know have stopped playing games because of how bad tempered it makes you.
So cut the bull CVG and start being honest about this very real problem. To claim gaming doesn't encourage violence is like trying to deny driving doesn't lead to road rage incidents.


I have gotten like this playing the Super Mario Brothers games in the past. They can be frickin' EVIL! I have lost count of the amount of times I have ranted playing that game. No guns in that one though.

There are plenty of games that are tricky that can get someone to be frustrated with the game and throw their controller around in a huff. It's not mutually exclusive to shooters. I am sure people have gotten frustrated and lobbed their Rubiks Cubes in the past too.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby amazingdweezo » 27 Feb 2013, 10:08

People are inspired by books,tv,games,film, role models etc,
But it is the person themselves who decide if it inspires them in a positive or negative way.

If a million people played assassins creed-

999,999 people will be inspired to buy books, delve deeper into the mythology, learn about historical events/people etc

1 weak, easily influenced, and probably uneducated, person will be inspired to go out and kill someone.

'Ban this sick filth' is not the correct antidote to this problem
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby richomack360 » 27 Feb 2013, 10:09

Stuart Richards wrote:. Everyone I know who plays computer games mood changes almost instantly when they start the game.


Perhaps you just know a right bunch of arseholes ?

They become highly stressed, agitated and extremely angry.


I assume this happens when they get in a car too, also assuming they are old enough to drive ? If so, then perhaps we should ban driving following your logic ? I hope they do not become stressed, agitated and extremely angry when faced with a real life situation ?

Especially when they lose, to deny this is just ludicrous.It's just part of gaming, everyone knows someone who takes things too seriously online, the rants and screams of online nuts are part of gaming lore.


Did anyone ban John McEnroe when he had a hissy fit ? Did Mr Pistorius have a hissy fit claiming another runner had longer blades than him ? Competitive environments ALWAYS bring out the best and worst of people, whether its tennis, athletics, football or gaming. Should we launch an investigation into competitive sports also and look to ban sports / events that may upset people ?

I and many people I know have stopped playing games because of how bad tempered it makes you.


I would suggest that's a problem with your level of tolerance towards sportsmanship and patience. You should really grow up a bit and you have probably done the right thing and stopped playing computer games as they are clearly not for you - and well done on the self defeating crusade of highlighting people with online rage, how bad they are and then admitting you (and others you know) are ones.

However congrats on giving up computer games, prob means one less buffoon I have to run into when online.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby FishyGinger » 27 Feb 2013, 10:33

richomack360 wrote: Did Mr Pistorius have a hissy fit claiming another runner had longer blades than him ?


Someone did. He shot them.

Too soon?
Some say he's half man, half fish. Others say its more of a 70/30 split. Whatever the percentage, he's one fishy bastard.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby WHERESMYMONKEY » 27 Feb 2013, 11:54

Stuart Richards wrote:When playing a first person shooter, you're placed at the heart of a battlefield experience and you kill hundreds of enemy with grenades, guns and knives. To try to claim that doesn't encourage violence, is about as absurd as it gets.

I'm Getting tired of the industry's denial of this very real problem. Everyone I know who plays computer games mood changes almost instantly when they start the game. They become highly stressed, agitated and extremely angry. Especially when they lose, to deny this is just ludicrous.It's just part of gaming, everyone knows someone who takes things too seriously online, the rants and screams of online nuts are part of gaming lore.

I and many people I know have stopped playing games because of how bad tempered it makes you.

So cut the bull CVG and start being honest about this very real problem. To claim gaming doesn't encourage violence is like trying to deny driving doesn't lead to road rage incidents.


It really doesn't, the fact of the matter is that videogame violence is about as far removed from actual violence as you can get and has about as much effect as any other form of media does.

A person who plays CoD for 60 hours a week would be completely ill equipped on a proper battlefield and would still be absolutely useless with a real firearm. Reason being if they made a game with actual realistic violence in it. people wouldnt want to play it.

If pressing start insatnly turns you into a spycho then maybe you need to start thinking about the deeper psychological and emotional issues you actually have or grow the f**k up. No one likes failing but i'm guessing you're the kind of person that gets arsy when they lose at anything digital or not.

Not going to say i dont get gaming torrets from time to time. But only in single player games and its more due to frustration over my own short comings and not the game's fault. In online matches i tend to be incredibly well manned and a good sportsman because i'm not a giant child that cant stand losing.

It's not a very real problem its a percieved problem by people who dont know what they're talking about. in the same way that tv, comics, rock music and the penny dreadful were all going to destroy society.

Also driving doesnt lead to road rage, being a burk leads to road rage, arseholes who dont know how to control their emotions leads to road rage. Problem is with emotionally retard jerks with anger issues, not games or cars.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby richomack360 » 27 Feb 2013, 13:06

FishyGinger wrote:
richomack360 wrote: Did Mr Pistorius have a hissy fit claiming another runner had longer blades than him ?


Someone did. He shot them.

Too soon?


Yeah, bit too soon..... :shock: With jokes being made about him like that he won't have a leg to stand on in court.

*gets coat, waits for law suit.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby FishyGinger » 27 Feb 2013, 13:53

richomack360 wrote:Yeah, bit too soon..... :shock: With jokes being made about him like that he won't have a leg to stand on in court.

*gets coat, waits for law suit.


It's really obvious what happened. He thought she was a replicant. She didn't answer the turtle question properly and boom.
Some say he's half man, half fish. Others say its more of a 70/30 split. Whatever the percentage, he's one fishy bastard.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby richomack360 » 27 Feb 2013, 14:32

FishyGinger wrote:
richomack360 wrote:Yeah, bit too soon..... :shock: With jokes being made about him like that he won't have a leg to stand on in court.

*gets coat, waits for law suit.


It's really obvious what happened. He thought she was a replicant. She didn't answer the turtle question properly and boom.


ahh right, well according to the government and leading idiot tabloids he must have been playing Grand Theft Auto: Motobility Edition beforehand - if you believe the hoo-hah
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby paperywhiteboy » 27 Feb 2013, 20:01

Stuart Richards wrote:They become highly stressed, agitated and extremely angry. Especially when they lose


You've basically just described anyone I know who plays sport.
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Re: In Quotes: Ian Livingstone on the absurdity of blaming v

Postby gmcb007 » 27 Feb 2013, 20:13

It doesn't matter how well you argue in the defense of games. It'll always be silenced by the ignorant politicians out to find scapegoats instead of dealing with the real problems of society.
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