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Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

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Rich McCormick demands harder games that don't make a mockery of skill and effort

Every time I run my eyes across my shelves, I get a little shudder.... read more

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Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby appyday » 01 Dec 2011, 13:08

Good article.... I agree with the principle although sometimes you need a game you can just bash through quickly and enjoy, rather than get repeatedly frustrated with when stuck. Enjoyment has to be a factor.... I dont want to pay £40 for a shelf decoration....
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Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby Orox » 01 Dec 2011, 13:21

One of the better articles I've read here. I agree wholeheartedly.

Difficulty scares this new generation of gamers and I fear games will only get easier as time progresses.
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Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby WHERESMYMONKEY » 01 Dec 2011, 13:24

Hear hear. Seeing the end of a game used to mean something in itself. Now its par the course. I never finished Demon souls.'More because my bloody ps3 died than through lack of trying but i played it to death for over 40 hours and still didn't think the end of anywhere in sight.

I've been putting off starting Dark souls for the exact same reason. I know i'll finish Skyrim, I know if its too hard i can turn the difficulty down and plod along. Demon souls will never do that. You're either up to the challenge or you're not.

It's kind of reassuring in a way.
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby RichPerry » 01 Dec 2011, 13:40

This article was a joy to read, as it was very weel written. I also agree, especially as I'm not the most gifted gamer in the world.

I am by no means a fantastic gamer, but I do try. If something is hard and I keep repeatedly dying, then it's my fault. I may yell at the game and swear profusely and even blame the game itself out loud, but I know it's down to me sucking, and I know I can do something about it if I calm down and try again.

Several games sit unfinished on my shelf, simply because I got stuck and couldn't progress. I'll go back to those at some point and try again, because these are the games I haven't traded in - I want to finish these games. They are my mountains. They might not be mountainous to everyone else, but the sense of achievement I'll get once I finish them will be monumental.
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby jdkoke » 01 Dec 2011, 13:48

Ninja Gaiden isn't hard!!
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby _Marty_ » 01 Dec 2011, 13:53

I never played Demon Souls, but Dark Souls I am totally loving. Beating a boss ends in a wave of euporia and a fist pump, that NO OTHER game I've experienced have.

Some gamers go on about how they want to be embroiled in the story, and can't be bothered with hard games. They don't understand why I crank the difficulty up, they don't get that sense of achievement I do when I beat a particularly tricky section of a game. And that's what Dark Souls is all about - the mini-victories while you battle through all the brutality. When finding a bonfire can feel like you've just had a lottery win...

And for that I'm eternally grateful. It harks back to the games of yesteryear, when you had a 10 hour game, 1 life and no check points.

Gamers today don't know what hard is! :)

Don't get me wrong, I do like a good story too, and I'm loving Skyrim as much as the next guy. But it's not testing me in any way. Given the time, I KNOW I'll finish it. But that's ok too, we do need games like this too. Not everything needs to be brutally difficult yet oh so rewarding...
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby wishface » 01 Dec 2011, 14:00

Dark Souls is not difficult it's just badly made.

Difficulty is abritrary. Some people find easy games difficult and vice versa. Who are these people claiming that games are too easy? Idiots. My friend was playing BF3 last night having rented it. He set it to easy because it was too hard for him otherwise. Should he be excluded from going for not being 'tuff enuff'?

What utter bullshit - much like the hype surrounding that godawful Dark Souls.

People want engaging and rewarding games, difficulty isn't remotely the issue nor sould it be.
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby wishface » 01 Dec 2011, 14:02

_Marty_ wrote:I never played Demon Souls, but Dark Souls I am totally loving. Beating a boss ends in a wave of euporia and a fist pump, that NO OTHER game I've experienced have.

That's the most insane logic I've ever heard. Byt that reasoning being stuck in a mine in Chile must be a great experience because the relief upon being rescued makes it all worthwhile!
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby jdkoke » 01 Dec 2011, 14:06

_Marty_ wrote:
Gamers today don't know what hard is! :)

Don't get me wrong, I do like a good story too, and I'm loving Skyrim as much as the next guy. But it's not testing me in any way. Given the time, I KNOW I'll finish it. But that's ok too, we do need games like this too. Not everything needs to be brutally difficult yet oh so rewarding...


Haha too true. I can't for the life of me understand people who put any game to easy and are happy. Am like you and love stories in games too and agree not every game needs to be brutal, but it's mare fun if it's a challenge. To me anyway. Any game I'll play on the hardest available difficulty or work my way up to it (ie FIFA). Even now am nearly 28 and hae limited gaming time there jus isna a point in playing things on easy, jus so I can say I completed it or seen the story? Blerugh! I know someone who is the same age as me and has gamed for 20 odd years like me and plays on easy :shock:

There are folk who just like everything to be easy and to them winning is what gets their rocks off even if it's on easy and they cheat to do it. My 9 year old step-son being one of them lol
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby jdkoke » 01 Dec 2011, 14:11

wishface wrote:
_Marty_ wrote:I never played Demon Souls, but Dark Souls I am totally loving. Beating a boss ends in a wave of euporia and a fist pump, that NO OTHER game I've experienced have.

That's the most insane logic I've ever heard. Byt that reasoning being stuck in a mine in Chile must be a great experience because the relief upon being rescued makes it all worthwhile!


Really? Really?

Being saved from a life threatening situation is the same as earning a victory you worked hard to achieve? Do you play any sport? It's the same as that not your bizarre example
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby jim2wheels » 01 Dec 2011, 14:13

wishface wrote:Dark Souls is not difficult it's just badly made.

Difficulty is abritrary. Some people find easy games difficult and vice versa. Who are these people claiming that games are too easy? Idiots. My friend was playing BF3 last night having rented it. He set it to easy because it was too hard for him otherwise. Should he be excluded from going for not being 'tuff enuff'?

What utter bullshit - much like the hype surrounding that godawful Dark Souls.

People want engaging and rewarding games, difficulty isn't remotely the issue nor sould it be.


What a voice of doom you are. Dark Souls is an excellent game, difficulty is arbitrary in any game. I would love to hear what nit-picking you define as part of a badly made game.

Edit: I just love how you seem to know what everyone else wants. There's a name for that.
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby G00N3R » 01 Dec 2011, 14:23

I'm not necessarily looking for games to be brutally difficult, but I do wish they would stop treating me like a childish noob. I'll use AC Revelations as an example because that's what I'm playing at the moment. In every story mission, the game tells me exactly where to go, exactly what to do, exactly how to do it and exactly when to do it. Its not the only recent game I can describe like that. The modern trend is to hold the player's hand with waypoint markers and step by step guides. I just wish more games would back off and let me figure stuff out on my own.
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby jdkoke » 01 Dec 2011, 14:27

G00N3R wrote:I'm not necessarily looking for games to be brutally difficult, but I do wish they would stop treating me like a childish noob. I'll use AC Revelations as an example because that's what I'm playing at the moment. In every story mission, the game tells me exactly where to go, exactly what to do, exactly how to do it and exactly when to do it. Its not the only recent game I can describe like that. The modern trend is to hold the player's hand with waypoint markers and step by step guides. I just wish more games would back off and let me figure stuff out on my own.


For an Arsenal fan you speak a lot of sense :wink:
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby AvatarIII » 01 Dec 2011, 14:35

I feel like I'm on both sides of the fence for this, for a freeform RPG, sure make it as hard as you want (assuming if I get stuck I can grind a bit to even the odds) but when I play a story based game, I want a challenge, but I don't want to not be able to finish it, I tend to play on the hardest mode available in games like that for this exact reason, Crysis 2, Uncharted 2 and 3, nice and challenging on the hardest mode, but not insurmountable. the COD games, eh, I'm of the opinion they should dump the single player aspect all together, that's not what people buy and play them for.
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Re: Dark Souls is fair, Call of Duty isn't

Postby zombiesinmyhead » 01 Dec 2011, 14:47

wishface wrote:
_Marty_ wrote:I never played Demon Souls, but Dark Souls I am totally loving. Beating a boss ends in a wave of euporia and a fist pump, that NO OTHER game I've experienced have.

That's the most insane logic I've ever heard. Byt that reasoning being stuck in a mine in Chile must be a great experience because the relief upon being rescued makes it all worthwhile!


No, I think you're top of the insane logic leader board right now. And the p**s and wind leader board too. What a magnificent day of soiled achivements this has been for you. Well done.
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